LISTEN to the Mindwhirl Marketing Podcast Ep 40 – Stop Marketing Like Everyone Else
WATCH The Mindwhirl Marketing Podcast Ep 40 – Stop Marketing Like Everyone Else
Podcast Transcript
Mike Miller
Today we’re going to talk about why you shouldn’t do what everyone else does with their marketing.
And remember, alignments, the key, the key to sales and marketing is alignment. And not everyone’s doing that. But the thing is, is that a lot of people are following everyone else. Like they’re just copying what everyone else is doing. And then wondering why they’re not getting results. Yes, it happens a lot. Yeah. So you have something that you want to share? I do.
Shelly Miller
It was perfect. Got to read it over the weekend. And yeah, read stuff from Bill Glazer before but it just it rang true, especially this weekend when I’m seeing, you know, one blog post being posted by three 400 msps. So, yeah, I thought this was perfect. And you want to tell us a little background story on who Bill Glazer is okay,
Mike Miller
So Bill Glazer was the founding member with Dan Kennedy of Glazer, Kennedy and Glazer Kennedy started and I’m going to say early 90s. It could have been as early as 86. But I read some Dan Kennedy books and eight and eight in the late 80s. But I don’t recall when Glaser Kennedy started anyway. Anyway, Glazer Kennedy is responsible basically for Frank Kern and Ryan deiss. And Russell Brunson, Russell Brunson, and everybody who is anybody, including Big Red in this industry. She gets all her stuff from Dan Kennedy. You know, that’s where it all came from. Glazer, Kennedy. But Bill Glazer apparently had a health issues, like 10 years back and sold his shares in Glazer, Kennedy, GKIC. And it’s gone downhill ever since. And it’s changed hands a couple times.
Shelly Miller
Yeah. That’s how I, you know, yeah, nothing was ever put out like this is exactly what took place. But from an outsider view, that’s what it seems like,
Mike Miller
yeah, after 10 years, we we pieced it together plus bill Glazer. So Bill Glazer, his health, he recovered, and he’s made a comeback. him and his daughter have basically started a company. And he’s written two books, and one of the books is outrageous advertising that’s outrageously successful. And then the second book was outrageous, multi step campaigns that are outrageously successful. And I think this is from that. Yeah,
Shelly Miller
yeah. Okay, so, basically, here it is. All right, the very first part of the book, okay. Okay. You may have heard the old saying that the definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over again, and expecting a different result. in marketing, we could say something very similar. The definition of insanity is doing the same things, as your competitors and expecting to beat them. But look around any industry and what kind of marketing Do you see business owners doing? Exactly the same kind of marketing their competitors are doing and hoping they get, they can do better? If you keep doing what everyone else in your industry is doing, you’re going to keep getting the same results. And most of your competitors are struggling. It’s like trying to learn to swim by watching a drowning man. Yeah, I mean, I,
Mike Miller
you know, it’s it’s so true. It is it is. And the thing is, you have to realize that he wrote this for industries where no one’s doing direct response, and everyone’s doing, like social media and branding. Yeah.
Shelly Miller
Oh, and by the way, this is your you’re correct. It’s outrageous multi step marketing. Okay. Okay.
Mike Miller
So, think about that. So he’s saying that what you need to do is direct response because it’s more It gets it’s designed to get a sale, as opposed to build awareness, or engagement or followers or awareness. Did I already say awareness? branding? Right. So it’s direct response is all about getting a sale. Now the question is, okay, that works well, it’s, it’s great. It’s outrageous. It’s it’s new, it’s different. You know, Dan Kennedy said, If everyone is running in one direction, the smart people run the other direction. So the question is the challenge. And I don’t even know if we can answer this, because we’re just kind of riffing on this. And deciding right now, how we feel about it. Right? But I’m wondering if what do you do if you’re in an industry where everybody is doing direct response? So everybody’s doing the thing that they’re saying, do this because it’s different. But now it’s not different? Everybody’s doing it? So what do you do?
Shelly Miller
There’s a bunch of things to do. Hmm. I mean, you could, I mean, I think the first thing that you should always look at is, because it’s seems to be really easy to copy what everybody else is doing. Yeah. And just just to preface this, we’re not saying that you should, everything needs to be that you shouldn’t take what people have learned through sales and marketing, right. And, you know, you don’t have to keep reinventing the wheel. That’s not what we’re saying. But we are saying, Well, here’s, here’s the example. And then maybe I can figure out how we could help people who have a lot of people in their industry who do do direct response. Okay. So people will look at a campaign that’s going on, and they’ll go, Oh, well, I can this. This is great. I can just I can see the whole campaign I got I’ve downloaded the ebook. So I’m going to do the landing page, just like it. I’m going to do the thank you pages just like it. Did the sequence just like it? Yeah. And they are a services industry. And that that they’re looking at to copy is for
Mike Miller
a product? Yeah, ecommerce or something. Yeah.
Shelly Miller
I mean, it’s like, how is that even remotely near the same? And then they don’t know why their campaigns don’t work. Right.
Mike Miller
So Exactly. There’s a lot of stuff and that’s the thing, like you always want to study the masters. You know, like, million dollar copywriters, you know, people who are or campaigns that made million dollar. Right, right. Least, yes. But nowadays, there’s campaigns, you know, everywhere. And even if you so like, you could go to Clickbank right now. And you could sort the products on Clickbank buy the best selling, and you could look at their sales page. And you could go, Okay, this is the best selling sales sales page for this product. And what you’ll notice is that if you look at number 234, through 10, yeah, they’re all copy in number one. Yes. Yeah. But number one is number one, for some reason. Yes. Right. And the reason is it like a parrot. Why is it number one, every other one, like almost copies every section has the same bullets. Maybe reworked a little bit, but the same emotions, the same customer language? You know, they have all the same things, but they don’t, they don’t work as well. Right? Right. So now it’s like copying is is a bad thing. It’s more like how do you sell it? You know, knowing how to sell Yes, how to how to set it up and and to demonstrate, to go through the product and to explain the product. Its value, its benefits. your offer. All of that is is extremely important to to sales and marketing. But it’s easy just to copy someone else.
Shelly Miller
It is and I mean, so to go. Just a riff on that. Yeah, the thing is, is if you have your you when you write and you in You are the face of your company, you’re the real you, you’ve gotten to that place where you’re, you’re extremely comfortable with yourself now and you can be you and you’ve also spent a lot of time knowing who your customer is. Yes. So you know what they have They speak and what they want and the problems that they’re having. You should also know where they are. And what they you know, are they on social media? Do they open your mail and call you? Do they respond to emails? So it’s good to know I have an outline of how like a sales campaign works, or a marketing campaign works. Yeah. But you have to you can’t just go Okay, well, she says, or he says to do this, this or this. And this, because even though there’s general ideas of how to do that, you also have to know your your ICP.
Mike Miller
Yeah, your your ideal customer, is it, they lead the way to how you should market? So then what you’re saying is then, so tone of voice is very important. Yes. Right. the personality of the copy? Yes. Right. And then where they’re at where they’re hanging out so that you know them, and you can reach them where they are?
Shelly Miller
Yes, you can be in front of in front of them there.
Mike Miller
Yes. Yeah. Okay. So other ways to separate yourself? I think, because direct response is superior. Well, if you’re ranking, so basically, you’re in business to make money. there’s times where you want everyone to know about you. But that’s not usually the time. That’s not usually what you’re thinking when you’re thinking about making sales and making money. Right, you’re thinking direct response. Okay, you’re thinking, I want to make a sale. I want some I want to make an offer and have someone purchase?
Shelly Miller
Yes.
Mike Miller
So direct response is typically focused on the there’s two ways to motivate people towards something and away from something. direct response is going to use both Yes, but they’re going to lean on away from away from the pain away from the problem. Right? Because the classic direct response, copywriting structure, structure is problem, agitate, solve, right? Except you don’t want to solve it. You want to share the solution, which is come to me, yeah, by for me, right. That’s how you’ll solve it. That’s not the solution at this moment. But okay, so we have aggressive lawn mower, guys. So hopefully, you don’t hear that racket that we hear. So anyway, I’m
Shelly Miller
gonna pause.
Mike Miller
Now, I will continue.
Shelly Miller
Okay, well, not everybody has aggressive lawnmower guys.
Mike Miller
Yeah, exactly. There’s just like ran ran right now. Um, so basically, I don’t know that you want to get away from direct response. But you want to kick it up a notch? Right? You want to do it better than your competitors. Now? How do you do it better than your competitors?
Mike Miller
Well, either more personality in your copy? That’s a good one. Right? Either more professional? Or more fun. Right? Yeah. So like separating yourself there. Also, the amount of material that you put out, right, so essentially, you could separate yourself from your competition just by the people you associate with the amount of content you put out the types of content you put out. The tone of voice that you have your design your colors, your brand. Yeah. Your offer your offers. Yeah, your offers could be different. Your it’s on the tip of my tongue. Basically, the quality of the graphics that you produce, yes, the design, right of everything that you do.
Shelly Miller
Yeah. And that’s a good point. So also, continually test so people will buy like 5000 postcards. Yeah. Somebody designed them. They’ll buy 5000 postcards, and by golly, they’re going to mail out all those postcards because they’re not wasting Yeah, even if it takes three years and even if they weren’t getting the return that they should have gotten. Yeah, they’ll just keep sending that same postcard. Yes, or that same sales letter. So a secondary part of this is that you need to evaluate your campaigns and when you send out how are they doing, you know, we need to constantly come back. You know, I remember when we first got in business that somebody said, you know, it’s, you’re never done. Yeah. And I’m, I’m the kind of person who, you know, I want to do task and be like, okay, check it off. I’m done. Yeah. So I had to kind of reframe my brain to go, yeah, I am done with this task. But I’m on to the next one. So it is, you know, with marketing and sales and owning a business, you’re never done. But remember, you don’t want to be because it’s the thing you want to do the most. And that’s why you’re doing it. So some days are easier than others. But that’s why you need to push through and continue to look at every aspect of your business so that you can make sure that it’s efficient, and is making the most money.
Mike Miller
Yeah, it’s, it’s a legal entity. So that’s just like you and me. It has I have a social security number, it has a tax identification number. It’s like a baby, you know, it has to grow, it has to be fed, it has to survive. And the only way to do that is to keep working. The well plan your work and work your plan. Right? Yes. But as far as doing the same thing everybody else is doing. You know, with your business, you have to realize that if you’re following a template that everyone else is using, if you’re using a campaign that everyone else is using, maybe that’s not the maybe that’s not serving you or your business the best. You know, and I know the thing is, is that the instructions are changed this around reworked
Shelly Miller
a little bit. I was gonna say that,
Mike Miller
yes. And I have never I have seen people try. And I’ve seen the same campaign over and over again.
Shelly Miller
Right. So you know, what we’ve heard is so you know, you get you get a box. I mean, we started a long time ago with these box marketing and sales things. Yeah. Duct Tape marketing. Yeah, I mean, there’s, we could say your market and name over and over and over again. And the, so the buyer gets excited, because all right, it’s all done. For me, it’s in a box, it’s gonna be so easy it is. And then you get the box. And I’m not even going to discuss here if the marketing is good or not. Because really, that’s a topic for another conversation. It’s alright long, but the but the while the topic is this, so the instructions always seem to be in those box boxes to for you to adapt it, rewrite it and rework it with your personality, right. However, this is what happens every time I open up the box, I’ll do this campaign. I’m going to change the logo. Tada, I’m done. So and if you think you’re the only one you’re not so the problem is, that’s why your server exists. Because this
Mike Miller
kind of
Shelly Miller
exactly, you’re going to see that you know, 50 other msps started this, you know, campaign.
Mike Miller
Yeah, and they didn’t change anything about their logo, steal that lead magnet and put my logo,
Shelly Miller
just just take it and put my logo on it. That’s good. My logo and phone number and we’re good to go. Right? didn’t cost me anything. Well, it cost you everything because your stuff looks exactly like the other eight people who sent your ICP or your your hopeful. new client, yeah, your prospect. The same thing. So who do they choose? Well, probably none of you. Yeah, because you all sent the same thing.
Mike Miller
Yes, exactly. And that’s another thing, so shocking. All packages, chalking all boxes, they really separate you from your competition. Because in most markets, most industries, you’re the only one if you do it, you’re the only one doing it. But in the MSP world, it’s almost like the anti, you know, like the, you know, what I mean, anti when you bet, it’s like what you have to do to enter. It’s not the barrier to entry, it’s the requirement that that you have to have in order to just compete. So it that’s a shame, because now if you’re not sending, you know, shocking all box, then you’re not competing. And where do you go? Like, yeah, but we really want your business so we’re gonna send an iPad in our shock and awe box right now. Yes. And we’re gonna create a special video to play on the iPad. That’s been done before. And it’s effective. But I guess you know, the thing is, it’s like this guide. I saw an old video Gary Halbert, and this guy stood up in front of him. And he’s like, you know, Gary, where does this end? You know, like, I’ve, I’ve driven my initial price down, down, down, down, down, down doing it for $1. You know, I’ve got to compete with all these different people, but now I’m like, giving away, you know, five $600 worth of stuff. It’s costing me like, $1,000 to get a customer. And then I’m giving them $500. I’ll, I’ll be working for them for six months before ever make a profit. You know, how far does this go? This seems like an arms race. Yeah. And Gary said, I know it. I wish I knew what to tell you. Yeah, I remember, you know, yes, the greatest copywriter greatest marketer of all times, he’s like, I know, it sucks, doesn’t it? But that’s really what we’re saying. We’re saying, if you’re doing the same thing, every what everybody else is doing, then it’s an arms race. Now, it’s just like, well, Russia has 1000 nuclear missiles. We need 1010. Yeah. And then Russia adds 50 more, and now we need 1100. You
Shelly Miller
No, and its not sustainable? You can’t? That’s not a solution. Exactly.
Mike Miller
Yeah. And so it goes back to what you said, like five podcasts ago? Have you tried just selling it? You just selling it? No. Why do you have to do all these? You know, rigamarole machinations? Hey, look, what we’re going to do for you. Don’t look under the hood. You know, this little beauty right here. It’s only had one owner, whatever. You know what I’m trying to say? I’m saying that. If you do what everyone else is doing, your results will likely be what everyone else is getting. But there comes a point in time. Like when your business as an MSP. Let’s look at the top 5%. Right. So you’re over $6 million a year? Well, at $6 million dollars a year, you start to realize, hey, all the stuff I’ve done and been doing. It’s tapped out. I have to do something else. Yes. What is the else that I’m going to do? It’s true, you know? Yes. So that’s what that’s when you have to start adding other tactics. Like maybe going hard on press releases, maybe going hard on your personal brand and doing interviews, yes. And speaking engagements, and, you know, really not not being the taking a role outside the company more as a figurehead personality, instead of the day to day owner.
Shelly Miller
Right? You’re the face of the company? Right?
Mike Miller
Like Robert herjavec.
Shelly Miller
Exactly, exactly, you know, yeah. And you should have goals for your business. So if you know, you want to get to that level of, you know, yearly profits, then you have to keep pushing it up a notch, you know, you have to keep getting better at what you do. And you do, you will get to places where this isn’t enough. I got to I got to push myself to the next area. And a lot of people choose to go out and do appearances, be the expert in history appear on shows, you know, that is a very good way to make your company known.
Mike Miller
Yes. Well, and I’ve said it a million times. Basically, that’s the future. That’s the future of sales and marketing. And the reason why is because Okay, McKinsey in 2014 did a study and the study said that by 2020 40% of the US workforce would be consultants. Yes. I remember that report. And the the, and 90% of them would be a one person company. So that means that that the US workforce is moving away from working for someone else, and towards working for themselves. And a consultant Tory role. You know, hey, I do this. I’m an expert at call centers, you know, I know how to speak to customers and make them happy. So I’m going to train your call center employees, you know, something like that. So I’m consultants. The thing is, is with 40% of the workforce, all consultants, how do you separate one from the other price? I mean, the only other way to do it is branding, personal brand, authority, expertise, right? As network, your personal network, right, so these are the things that you have to think about, as far as marketing, just like everyone else. What are the little things that are gonna give you the edge? Yes. Alright, so now we’re, we really have to look at NASCAR. Oh, no, that’s a weird euphemism. Or, you know, but but basically, here’s the thing with NASCAR. Every car is the same. They’re filing paint off, you know, they’re filing the undercarriage to try to lose an ounce. Yes, they’re there. You know, the, the, the air in the left tire is less than the air in the right tire or something like that. It’s a great analogy.
Shelly Miller
Yes, they all have the same car. Yes. So it’s minute, small, little things.
Mike Miller
And just exactly it’s, it’s in turn nine, don’t let off the gas. You know what I mean? Like keep it pegged on in turn not. It’s just little things that separate you from your competition. And your job is to find them. But what I can suggest is don’t do what everybody else is doing. If If you know what the aspirin campaign is, and everybody that you know, has sent it, maybe you shouldn’t send an aspirin campaign, because odds are, you’re your leads. have seen it. Yep, it’s the truth. And if they’ve already seen it, then it’s not gonna be.
Shelly Miller
It’s gonna be a waste, really, because they’ve seen it.
Mike Miller Yes, exactly. So anyway, I think we’ve covered it. I have a couple other examples, but we’re running out of time, and they’re best save for another day.
